Throttle as a safety feature.

[neutron]

I've had my ebike for almost five months now and have about 1000 miles on it so far. Based on my experience I'm convinced that having a throttle is a safety feature that should be recommended to anyone buying an ebike and also proposed as a safety feature to any legislators trying to regulate ebikes. It seems like the trend is to ban throttles as some kind of unnecessary feature that is abused by bikers using excess speed. I'm sure this happens but I think the safety aspect of a throttle is way more prevalent. For me, starting out using the throttle has a more balanced feel to the bike instead of peddling to start off. I also rely on the throttle when maneuvering in tight areas or turns at low speed. I feel like I can better control and balance the bike at very low speed. I noticed when I went to get my motorcycle license, the biggest part of the riding test was to see how you handled the bike at low speed where balance was more difficult. They didn't care how you did at highway speeds, only how you managed at stop signs and low speed turns. If you had to put your foot down during a low speed turn you would fail the test. Using the throttle is just a safer way to ride in some instances and should be encouraged, not banned by law or ordinances passed by ignorant of the facts bureaucracies. If your local jurisdiction wants to ban ebikes with throttles, please write or call and explain how a throttle is a great safety feature and is especially good for senior citizens that might need a little extra help balancing in certain situations.

 

[TylerJones3194]

I agree completely, Unfortunately as ebikes are evolving and becoming very popular not all companies are making ebikes for the reason they should be used. Due to this they are testing the limits of the current laws in place which is where its a question of is the a ebike or motorcycle and how do we regulate this. Plus when you have people going 30+mph and not pedaling getting into accidents riding like there's no tomorrow, fingers will be pointed. Only takes a few to ruin it for us all. I work at a ebike shop and I have seen some crazy aftermaths with people who ride it like they stole it. I don't think they will do anything anytime soon, they are just cracking down on top speed and what class the ebike is considered. Ride safe!

 

[Django]

Like everything, there are often two sides. I don’t know of any jurisdiction where throttles, (class 2 eBikes), are flat out banned, but there may be some. Many bike paths and bike lanes don’t want people tooling along at 20 mph on a heavy, motorized eBike because it endangers pedestrians, equestrians and other bicycle riders.

I don’t disagree that a throttle could be helpful in the situations that you mentioned, but unfortunately, a throttle is often abused. Maybe an alternative would be an amendment to the class 1 specification would be allow a throttle up to for example 8 or maybe 10 mph so that it could be used to get someone going and for low speed maneuvering while not presenting a danger to others.

 

[neutron]

In my experience it's the road bikes that are the fastest on my bike trail. They blow past me like I'm sitting still and I'm doing the speed limit @ 15 mph. The ebikes may sometimes seem like they are flying down the trail because of the noise from the fat tires and some probably are. Still, the spandex wearing, logo covered Lance Armstrong wannabes far outnumber the ebikes. On occasion I've tried to catch up with a few that blew past me just to see how fast they were going, but my bike won't go over 25 on flat trails and I couldn't catch up.

 

[Django]

In my experience it's the road bikes that are the fastest on my bike trail. They blow past me like I'm sitting still and I'm doing the speed limit @ 15 mph. The ebikes may sometimes seem like they are flying down the trail because of the noise from the fat tires and some probably are. Still, the spandex wearing, logo covered Lance Armstrong wannabes far outnumber the ebikes. On occasion I've tried to catch up with a few that blew past me just to see how fast they were going, but my bike won't go over 25 on flat trails and I couldn't catch up.

I don’t doubt that some “Lance Armstrong wannabes“ ride at speeds that are not appropriate on bike paths, but as an old roadie, I can say that serious cyclists don’t tend to ride on bike paths except when commuting or going for a leisurely ride with friends or family, and if they are riding above the speed allowed on the path, they can get fined the same as anyone else. Two wrongs don’t make a right. A conventional cyclist abusing a privilege doesn’t mean that eBike riders should be allowed to abuse that privilege. Neither is entitled to endanger others.

Many including myself consider an ebike with a throttle to be a motorized vehicle because it doesn’t require the rider to supply any effort. Many others don’t see why class 2 bikes should be subject to restrictions. It’s an often heated debate. A throttle that provides all of the propulsion up to 20 mph is not necessary to get someone going or for low speed maneuvering and poses increased risk to others that they share a path with, (and so do yahoos on unpowered bike).

Typically, but not always, the “spandex wearing, logo covered” riders have good bike handling skills and are riding lightweight equipment and opposed to say a 12 year old kid riding an 80 pound eBike using it as a little motorcycle. Worse yet is an inexperienced 300 pound rider on a 100 pound eBike tooling along at 20 mph. That 400 pound projectile can do a lot more damage that the 170-200 pound spandex wearing, logo covered Lance Armstrong wannabe.

A side not, I don’t think that any roadie wants to be Lance Armstrong anymore. I still want to be Greg Lemond, but I am an old roadie.

 

[neutron]

Yes I agree that neither road bikes or ebikes should exceed the speed limits on trails where you have walkers and people walking dogs. If they want to go 30+mph on the street, fine with me as long as they follow the same rules as motorists have to. It's the ones weaving in and out of others on the trail that bothers me. They also tend to be the ones that shoot across the intersections, barely slowing down, and forcing traffic to stop when the stop sign sign is on the trail and not the road. I live on a heavily used rail trail near an intersection so I see this every day. Maybe percentage wise the ebikes are as bad as the road bikes but since there are far fewer of them it seems the road bikes are the problem for now. Also the ebike riders tend to be older folks. I don't see many kids on ebikes on our trail.

 

[m@Robertson]

Unfortunately I live in an area where the 'analog' road bike riders are the true menace on the bike paths. In this area, we have a fairly well-established bike path, and we also have a slew of tourists who make the streets a menace for bikes; with international visitors who barely know which side of the road they are supposed to be on, and lookie-loo's gawking at the scenery. So on the path, we also have the same idiot pedestrians, but we also have all of the local recreational cyclists who are (rightfully) pissed off they have to put up with all the on-foot morons who ignore the fact they are supposed to stay on the pedestrian part of the path, walk 4- or 5-wide and become moving roadblocks, walk while looking at their phone and change directions randomly ... et cetera.

It seems almost like a thing here that road bike riders want to teach the foot traffic a lesson by banzai'ing down the path and then swerving directly in front of a pedestrian as they pass from behind to startle them into realizing wtf they are doing wrong.

The fact that commuters on their way to work are also on this path doesn't make things any better. Oh and don't get me started on the Surrey bikes. Riding on the weekend here during tourist season is almost too dangerous to attempt. Especially down near the pier where there are a couple thousand seals doing a mating thing and zillions of maroons are there gawking and crowding the path.

I try and do my chores in the early morning or evening when many are doing something else indoors.

As to the OP's subject in this thread, throttles do exactly what he says they do. They are especially useful on a heavy cargo bike laden with half a shopping cart full of stuff. A walking-speed turn or a start from a dead stop at a light are best handled with a dab of throttle.

 

[Django]

Unfortunately I live in an area where the 'analog' road bike riders are the true menace on the bike paths. In this area, we have a fairly well-established bike path, and we also have a slew of tourists who make the streets a menace for bikes; with international visitors who barely know which side of the road they are supposed to be on, and lookie-loo's gawking at the scenery. So on the path, we also have the same idiot pedestrians, but we also have all of the local recreational cyclists who are (rightfully) pissed off they have to put up with all the on-foot morons who ignore the fact they are supposed to stay on the pedestrian part of the path, walk 4- or 5-wide and become moving roadblocks, walk while looking at their phone and change directions randomly ... et cetera.

It seems almost like a thing here that road bike riders want to teach the foot traffic a lesson by banzai'ing down the path and then swerving directly in front of a pedestrian as they pass from behind to startle them into realizing wtf they are doing wrong.

The fact that commuters on their way to work are also on this path doesn't make things any better. Oh and don't get me started on the Surrey bikes. Riding on the weekend here during tourist season is almost too dangerous to attempt. Especially down near the pier where there are a couple thousand seals doing a mating thing and zillions of maroons are there gawking and crowding the path.

I try and do my chores in the early morning or evening when many are doing something else indoors.

As to the OP's subject in this thread, throttles do exactly what he says they do. They are especially useful on a heavy cargo bike laden with half a shopping cart full of stuff. A walking-speed turn or a start from a dead stop at a light are best handled with a dab of throttle.

I sympathize with your situation. I guess that this is why different regions need to have their own regulations. I live in rural New Hampshire and generally ride the gravel roads of New Hampshire and Vermont. The only bike path within 20 miles is a rail trail, but the dirt bikes and four wheelers make it a poor choice for a bicycle. The closest bike lane is 25 miles away. There is no worry about class around here because we have no bicycle infrastructure.

The real problem seems to be that humans have and continue to overpopulate and this causes among other things, congestion In areas of dense populations, but that is a conversation for a different forum.

As I said earlier, maybe there should be an amendment made to the Class 1 specification that would allow a low speed throttle, (maybe 8 or 10 mph), so that people could get going easily and use it for low speed maneuvering without causing the throttle associated problems caused by riders using an ebike as an unregistered and uninsured motorbike. I could of course be wrong, (not the first time).

I am happy with my class 1 and my conventional bikes, but I can see a time in my future when a low speed throttle would be a great asset.

 

[neutron]

I never thought about a limited throttle for class 1 ebikes but it sounds like a good idea. Again, I would view it as a safety feature.

 

[jimthecanoeist]

I don’t doubt that some “Lance Armstrong wannabes“ ride at speeds that are not appropriate on bike paths, but as an old roadie, I can say that serious cyclists don’t tend to ride on bike paths except when commuting or going for a leisurely ride with friends or family, and if they are riding above the speed allowed on the path, they can get fined the same as anyone else. Two wrongs don’t make a right. A conventional cyclist abusing a privilege doesn’t mean that eBike riders should be allowed to abuse that privilege. Neither is entitled to endanger others.

Many including myself consider an ebike with a throttle to be a motorized vehicle because it doesn’t require the rider to supply any effort. Many others don’t see why class 2 bikes should be subject to restrictions. It’s an often heated debate. A throttle that provides all of the propulsion up to 20 mph is not necessary to get someone going or for low speed maneuvering and poses increased risk to others that they share a path with, (and so do yahoos on unpowered bike).

Typically, but not always, the “spandex wearing, logo covered” riders have good bike handling skills and are riding lightweight equipment and opposed to say a 12 year old kid riding an 80 pound eBike using it as a little motorcycle. Worse yet is an inexperienced 300 pound rider on a 100 pound eBike tooling along at 20 mph. That 400 pound projectile can do a lot more damage that the 170-200 pound spandex wearing, logo covered Lance Armstrong wannabe.

A side not, I don’t think that any roadie wants to be Lance Armstrong anymore. I still want to be Greg Lemond, but I am an old roadie.

Safe use of an ebike would be compromised by elimination of the throttle. It does not eliminate effort; it supplements it as needed.
Slow maneuvering for example. The power added with peddling is too often in excess of what is prudent. A small amount of throttle is more controllable than using the peddles - even with peddle assist set to minimum boost.
With dirt riding, hills or banks often overcome what the peddle assist adds (normally a setting that the rider can misjudge and experience shows is mainly overestimated). If the climbing slows more than is expected, an application of throttle will add to the peddle boost and allow completion of the maneuver. If the bike stalls out, it is a risk to the rider who, faced without expected results, are out-of-balance and possibly rolling backward out of control.
Like all conveyances, inappropriate operation is the problem - not the capability of the bike. Let's leave the roadie world alone and other biking as well. Focus on rider behavior and not their choice of bikes.

 

[jimthecanoeist]

An e-bike offroad can be a benefit to the comfort of other trail users. It can be an alternative to less quiet, heavier, and often speedier motorcycles. A hiker might be less inclined to be an anti-bike activist if their encounters are with something electric. When I pause my e-bike to let other users pass, there are no annoying engine sounds - just silence and an opportunity to have a pleasant exchange of geetings.

 

[LightningP38]

I've had my ebike for almost five months now and have about 1000 miles on it so far. Based on my experience I'm convinced that having a throttle is a safety feature that should be recommended to anyone buying an ebike and also proposed as a safety feature to any legislators trying to regulate ebikes. It seems like the trend is to ban throttles as some kind of unnecessary feature that is abused by bikers using excess speed. I'm sure this happens but I think the safety aspect of a throttle is way more prevalent. For me, starting out using the throttle has a more balanced feel to the bike instead of peddling to start off. I also rely on the throttle when maneuvering in tight areas or turns at low speed. I feel like I can better control and balance the bike at very low speed. I noticed when I went to get my motorcycle license, the biggest part of the riding test was to see how you handled the bike at low speed where balance was more difficult. They didn't care how you did at highway speeds, only how you managed at stop signs and low speed turns. If you had to put your foot down during a low speed turn you would fail the test. Using the throttle is just a safer way to ride in some instances and should be encouraged, not banned by law or ordinances passed by ignorant of the facts bureaucracies. If your local jurisdiction wants to ban ebikes with throttles, please write or call and explain how a throttle is a great safety feature and is especially good for senior citizens that might need a little extra help balancing in certain situations.

For me, having had 2 heart attacks on bike rides, my throttle is an absolute safety feature to get me to help if I should have another heart attack or a stroke while riding solo.
Plus, with a recumbent bike, a throttle makes launching the bike much safer, as a bent start can be a bit wobbly. When I was younger, I had no need for e-assist to launch, but I do now. If I need to put both feet down in a rough spot in a trail, I can use the throttle to get thru it while keeping my balance with my feet down.

 

[addertooth]

I fear I am going to show my mid-western roots. I believe dangerous "Behavior" should be punished, and not the tool you use to perform your poor choices with.

The issue is going too fast in a congested area, which is an Operator Choice. As others have stated, unsafe speed can be accomplished a variety of ways, some of which do not include a throttle.

I remember when London tried to ban knives, even kitchen knives from being carried in public. Their goal was to reduce assaults/murders. But last I checked, there were laws already on the books for assault (and/or) murder. It is a common logical flaw made by advanced societies to falsely believe they can prevent an outcome, by focusing on the "tool" rather than the person.

Call me old fashioned, but in this age of smart-phone/cameras everywhere, it is quite sensible to focus on undesired behavior. Let those who behave sensibly simply enjoy their lives. Those who create excessive risk (or actual harm) face consequences.

Any other view simply assumes that every human is an idiot, and incapable of self-regulating. This assumption is false.

 

[arthurdent18610]

I've had my ebike for almost five months now and have about 1000 miles on it so far. Based on my experience I'm convinced that having a throttle is a safety feature that should be recommended to anyone buying an ebike and also proposed as a safety feature to any legislators trying to regulate ebikes. It seems like the trend is to ban throttles as some kind of unnecessary feature that is abused by bikers using excess speed. I'm sure this happens but I think the safety aspect of a throttle is way more prevalent. For me, starting out using the throttle has a more balanced feel to the bike instead of peddling to start off. I also rely on the throttle when maneuvering in tight areas or turns at low speed. I feel like I can better control and balance the bike at very low speed. I noticed when I went to get my motorcycle license, the biggest part of the riding test was to see how you handled the bike at low speed where balance was more difficult. They didn't care how you did at highway speeds, only how you managed at stop signs and low speed turns. If you had to put your foot down during a low speed turn you would fail the test. Using the throttle is just a safer way to ride in some instances and should be encouraged, not banned by law or ordinances passed by ignorant of the facts bureaucracies. If your local jurisdiction wants to ban ebikes with throttles, please write or call and explain how a throttle is a great safety feature and is especially good for senior citizens that might need a little extra help balancing in certain situations.

I have a 2015/6 cyclotricity stealth 48v 250/1000w & it has a fully operational legal throttle. In the lower setting it propels you all the way upto the legal 15.5mph though if you go into the settings it'll do 20mph on throttle alone, 28mph if you pedal. The throttle even works in PAS 0 unlike my lankeleisi mg740plus. The cadence sensor on the cyclotricity is way to sensitive unlike the throttle. The powers that be want us out of our gas guzzling vehicles, yet there making it virtually impossible to legally own an ebike, maximum power 250w, maximum speed 15.5mph & throttles can only assist upto 3.6mph. What's wrong with a 1000w, 20-25mph & fully operational throttles. You could make it mandatory to have insurance just incase you hurt yourself or a pedestrian.

 

[Jeffb]

I never thought about a limited throttle for class 1 ebikes but it sounds like a good idea. Again, I would view it as a safety feature.

What are you thinking? Anytime someone comes up with a "good idea" it's never going to be adopted.

 

[neutron]

Well I wouldn't go so far as to say that but I know what you mean. I think Django's idea of a low speed throttle for class one is an idea worth pursuing. My biggest fear regarding ebikes is government regulation. Pushing throttles as a safety feature instead of a menace might head off any potential restrictions on throttles that some "do it for the children" politician might come up with.

 

[LastButNotLeast]

Any other view simply assumes that every human is an idiot, and incapable of self-regulating. This assumption is false.

Maybe not every, but certainly a VERY large percentage.

 

[Smaug]

By US definition, throttles on eBikes are to be limited to 20 mph, for Class 2 & 3. I think that's reasonable, since an athletic person can pedal a road bike at 20 mph almost whenever he wants.

It should be noted that at lower speed maneuvers, most eBikes can easily be stopped from falling by putting a foot down; it isn't a monumental feat of strength like it is for a motorcycle, so I don't consider it as much of a safety feature, but more for convenience.

 

[HumanPerson]

I have a friend in town that now rides an ebike, he used to ride regular bikes until an auto accident so
the ebike has helped him recently to get back into the swing of things.

He got a (now don't laugh) lol cheap amazon Glamvilla ebike

Amazon.com

36v 12.5ah and his ebike has throttle he said he's gonna unhook so he can ride trails.
He said he almost wiped out because of the throttle

 

[Smaug]

<snip>
He said he almost wiped out because of the throttle

Well, it is a bronco after all. It was just trying to buck him off!