California looking at new law about e bike licensing and training.

[JerryB]

All mega cities around the world that I've lived in have crappy neighborhoods.
Crappy place or not, it's where most people flock to, when trying to make it on their own; it's what you make of it.
The grit it takes to arrive in NYC with nothing but what you can carry and make it here in NYC is what makes this country unique.
NYC is not just another world, it's hundreds of worlds crammed into few square mile.
NYC is not for everybody, just as e-bike is not for everybody; if you can make it here, you can make it anywhere.

Most big cities are great places to be "from". We were blessed to retire early after very successful careers in big cities....now we live rural in our paradise.....now....if I pull up to a stop sign and see two other cars.....I wonder where all the conjestion came from. I hope everyone finds their paradise.....whatever that is.

 

["A"]

Most big cities are great places to be "from". We were blessed to retire early after very successful careers in big cities....now we live rural in our paradise.....now....if I pull up to a stop sign and see two other cars.....I wonder where all the conjestion came from. I hope everyone finds their paradise.....whatever that is.

I bought my own place in PA 20 years ago, since it is 12 miles from a national park (which I can cycle to),
1/2 mi. from my driveway is trailhead with 40+ miles of rails-to-trail, which connects to the Appalachian Trails System,
through multiple protected open spaces.
For 20 years, I've rarely have to transport my bicycles or e-bikes to ride them over long distances.

Where do the congestion come from?
Amazon deliveries, grocery store deliveries by 18-wheelers, just everyday shopping that most Americans do require trucks to ship good across vast distances.
In the big cities are even worse when you combine them with people commute in single occupant vehicles. More population, more stuff needs to be transported & delivered.

I'm only in NYC because of my in-laws, they need care & transport few times a week.
If it were up to me, I would not be living in mega cities. I know my ways around them, living among & within them.. but 24/7 city life is for the young.

 

[Hoggdoc]

Most big cities are great places to be "from". We were blessed to retire early after very successful careers in big cities....now we live rural in our paradise.....now....if I pull up to a stop sign and see two other cars.....I wonder where all the conjestion came from. I hope everyone finds their paradise.....whatever that is.

Jerry I can't agree more thats why 6 years ago I left SOCAL to South West Washington State. I have been back in SOCAL for the last year helping my very aged Dad (92) but sure miss my home in Washington. I will be returning there as soon as possible.

 

["A"]

California wants to create a driver’s license for electric bikes

California wants to create a driver’s license for electric bikes

A driver’s license for electric bikes? It could soon be a reality in California if a new bill passes the state assembly.

electrek.co

Personally, I think licensing is not the right approach.
Education at schools about traffic safety & laws should be implemented, from childhood all the way to high school.
In many countries around the world, cycling and traffic laws are part of curriculum required for their schools. Cycling should be like a life long skill that everyone should know, like swimming.. or maybe even math.

I feel that in America, most drivers think bicycles & motorcycles don't belong on public roads, which is a mentality that's been imbedded across decades of car culture and cheap oil in America.

As a teenager (in the 80's), I pedaled across the N American Continent from Seattle, WA to Ocean City, MD, on a Huffy 10-speed packed with 35-40 lb. of camping gear. Long before the time of cell phones & GPS. The slower pace gave me the chance to see America at 15-20 mph and how Americans really lived along the way.

Nowadays, I don't think most people in America even bother to try to understand how the rest of the country live. More over when homeless people in the streets are considered to be criminals and the real criminals getting government bailouts, tax breaks & tax write-offs for private jets or yachts.

Meanwhile, I still think parents should also be held accountable when their child is caught breaking traffic laws, causing accidents on high-seed e-bikes. If they can afford high cost, high speed e-bikes to for their children, they can also afford higher (x5 or x10) auto insurance premiums.

 

[Calsun]

The real problem is too many distracted drivers looking at their cell phones instead of the road. Even in California where there is a "hands free" law in effect it is never ever enforced by the cops. I cannot go 5 miles on the freeway without seeing someone leaving their lane as they are focused on the cell phone in their hand.

NYC keeps the best accident statistics and is the most thorough in determing the factors involved and invariable it is drivers that are inattentive or drivers that are driving too fast. But when a motorist kills a bicyclist they are the only one who gets to talk to the cop taking down the report and no American motorist is going to say it was their fault.

 

[JerryB]

I've always liked George Carlin's quote.....it really applies to many of our current issues and problems.

"Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that."​

 

[Train Dan]

Wake up and smell the Sanka. The Cops don't have time or support to arrest real criminals, let alone trying to catch kids buzzing around on E-bikes.
Just because a law exists does not mean it will be enforced or observed. Or even if it's truly necessary.
Dan

 

["A"]

Horrific Crash on Manhattan Bridge Bike Path Underscores Moped Crisis
According to the NYPD's crash statistics, there were 44,754 reported crashes between January 1 and June 23.
Of those, 43,188 — or 96 percent — were caused by drivers of cars, SUVs, trucks, ambulances, vans and other heavy motorized vehicles.
Just 826 crashes — or 1.8 percent — were caused by the operators of e-bikes, e-scooters, mopeds or motorbikes, according to the police.
Another 740 crashes — or 1.6 percent — were caused by regular bike riders, the cops said.

Drilling down further, there have been 3,952 crashes that caused injuries to at least one pedestrian.
Of those crashes, 3,784 — or 96 percent again — were caused by car and truck drivers.
Only 168 — or 4.2 percent — were caused by the operators of e-bikes, e-scooters, mopeds or motorbikes, according to the police.

Horrific Crash on Manhattan Bridge Bike Path Underscores Moped Crisis - Streetsblog New York City

Illegal and legal mopeds are forbidden yet are increasingly common on the span as delivery workers shift to faster vehicles to make their meager living.

nyc.streetsblog.org

Why New York City wants electric bikes stopped at the border

Why New York City wants electric bikes stopped at the border

New York City is enacting a ban on electric bikes that don't conform to UL standards in an attempt to eliminate e-bike battery fires in NYC.

electrek.co

 

[JerryB]

Any form of transportation causes some accidents.....back in the 1890's when NYC had 200,000+ horses on the streets everyday......more people were injured or killed statistically than in auto's today......moving people around means some accidents......horses....ebikes....cars....trains....airplaness....boats......doesn't matter........most people will be safe......some won't.

 

[Seaguy]

It breaks my heart to see parents buy e bikes for their children who so desperately need the exercise. I had no interest in e bikes until I got too old to hump the hills of my neighborhood, although I know that people need them to commute. All in all, I guess I agree with the above that people will do silly things. I can't believe there's gonna be significant enforcement in this area considering that the police can't enforce half of the laws we have on the books now.

 

["A"]

The New York Times attacks e-bikes while ignoring the real danger all around us

The 'New York Times' attacks e-bikes while ignoring the real danger all around us

Recent articles in the 'New York Times' about e-bike safety have been largely absent of analysis on the things killing e-bike riders: cars.

electrek.co

Every crash in this story involves a e-bike colliding with a motor vehicle.

All could’ve been avoided if e-bike riders were protected from cars (or if there were no cars).

Fight the real enemy.

‘A Dangerous Combination’: Teenagers’ Accidents Expose E-Bike Risks

The e-bike industry is booming, but many vehicles are not legal for teenagers, and accidents are on the rise.

t.co

— David Zipper (@DavidZipper) July 29, 2023

“By various measures, the risks of serious injury and death rise sharply at around 20 m.p.h.,
although much of that research involved collisions between cars and pedestrians.
For instance, the risk of severe injury to a pedestrian is 25 percent when the car is moving at 16 m.p.h.,
and it rises to 50 percent at 23 m.p.h., according to the AAA Foundation for Traffic Safety.”

 

[RSU]

I like the age requirement but.....keep in mind.....the state will make money from this if it passes.....the license will cost you money....the training will cost you money.....soon after.....mandated insurance will be required.......it's all about the money.

Yup, but you forget to lay the blame on all the A-Holes that RUIN IT FOR EVERYONE ELSE! I've been saying this for 5 years now...to call out idiots throttling through town in and out of traffic. This is why we can't have nice things!

 

[Detectorguy]

With parents buying e-bikes for their kids ? What ever happened to kids getting exercise for those growing muscles and bones ? Keep a kid healthy.

 

["A"]

I doubt the parents are buying these ebikes, more than likely teens just get a hold of parents'credit card and buy whatever they want for themselves.
That's why the parents need to be held accountable with their auto insurance premium going up x5 or x10 when their kids are responsible for accident cause by these ebikes.

 

[Mark P]

Well with so many people getting e bikes now looks like because as you read article. Amount of injuries and kids and worse lost life. Cities are seeing to many riding them fast , no helmets, not follows the rules to be safe. So read article and speak up what you think. I know when I ride my e bike I've got my helmet on gloves, mirror and make sure I'm seen by other and treat people with respectful. I'm just trying to enjoy and exercising. Already old and with back and knee problems just makes using a e bike to get around still .

California bill would require e-bikers to have license, mandate training

A bill moving through the California legislature could tighten the rules on electric bikes and make it illegal for people under a certain age to ride them.

fox5sandiego.com

The government of California is the most anti- growth government in America. They will tax you, tax our hobbies, and tax you when you leave. It is like jail there. I left a few years ago and live in Georgia. Best/hardest thing I ever did. Right move though.

 

[Smaug]

With parents buying e-bikes for their kids ? What ever happened to kids getting exercise for those growing muscles and bones ? Keep a kid healthy.

My daughter has been asking me to buy her a dirtbike or mini bike since she was a wee lass. (about 5) I've always resisted, even though I know why she wants one. I did too!

When I got heavily into eBikes a year or so ago, she of course wanted one too and I didn't have much of a leg to stand on, as I need the exercise even more than she does. (she's on the swim team) My second eBike was one that was suitable for her, as a 10 year-old. When she comes to visit, she sometimes rides that one. (Lectric XP Lite)

Lately, I've been getting more into regular cycling. Joined a club and everything. I tuned up her acoustic bike, which she rode yesterday. Last week, someone traded in a nice little Trek 1000 road bike at the LBS on a new bike. It appeared that it might fit her for a couple years. I took her in and the crossbar just BARELY hits her crotch. She's in a growth spurt now, so we're going to buy it. ($250) She's going to do road biking with me.

We'll still do eBiking and ride the more comfortable mBikes around town, but she'll get that exercise.

I doubt the parents are buying these ebikes, more than likely teens just get a hold of parents'credit card and buy whatever they want for themselves.
That's why the parents need to be held accountable with their auto insurance premium going up x5 or x10 when their kids are responsible for accident cause by these ebikes.

You're not a parent, are you? Most parents would notice if their kid stole their credit card and bought an eBike and there would be severe consequences.

Also, this is kind of the opposite of what you said a couple posts ago, that the motorists are causing most of the accidents.

 

[JerryB]

The government of California is the most anti- growth government in America. They will tax you, tax our hobbies, and tax you when you leave. It is like jail there. I left a few years ago and live in Georgia. Best/hardest thing I ever did. Right move though.

Some states have bad tax policies....some states take women rights away.....some states teach slavery was a positive thing.....some states want to dictate sexual orientation.....some states don't want you drive.......some states encourage homelessness..........some states have cold, hot and humid weather........pick your poison.........I was from Calif as well......great place to have a successful career.....also a great place to be "from.......as for Georgia.......they have one of the highest obesity rates in the country but their fried chicken is wonderful.....just don't eat too much.

 

["A"]

You're not a parent, are you? Most parents would notice if their kid stole their credit card and bought an eBike and there would be severe consequences.

Also, this is kind of the opposite of what you said a couple posts ago, that the motorists are causing most of the accidents.

Not a parent myself, but I deal with kids who zip around on $7k SurRon, using $1.2k iPhone, drive $50k Tesla, drink daily Starbucks for $8 a shot..
Their parents don't really care about what they spend on their credit cards, much less what they do while riding their ebikes on public roads.
Which I suspect is what's happening in California, where high speed capable ebikes are causing accidents with teen operators, hence the call for legislation for licensing.
More than likely, those parents with kids that are riding high speed capable ebikes and cause accidents, can afford x5 or x10 auto insurance premium than spending time to educate their kids.
Priorities are different for everyone, or every parent.
I think my posts in this thread have been consistent with my thoughts on legislation to license ebike usage.

 

[Smaug]

OK, I see. You weren't referring to middle class kids.

I thought it was inconsistent because you said (and backed up with a research reference) that the lion's share of the accidents are caused by motorists, but then went on to blame rich kids. I'm sure those kids (and their lack of parental guidance) do cause some problems too.

 

[JerryB]

I don't like Santa​

He gives all the expensive gifts only to the rich kids