Yamaha Wabash RT

[Smaug]

I brought my cycling kit, ready to ride it 20+ miles.

They had it half charged when I got there, which was enough for about 25 miles. No problems.

It’s awesome pedaling this efficient ebike around at 20-25 mph.

I’m going to need a few hundred trouble-free miles to give me confidence in it.

 

[Dirthog]

It is a very versatile bike. I can't imagine that you not making good use of it's capabilities.

 

[Smaug]

It is a very versatile bike. I can't imagine that you not making good use of it's capabilities.

Thanks, I’ll try!
It seems to be built pretty ruggedly, but I don’t think I’ll ever use the dropper seat post or knobby tires.

I think I’ll remove the dropper and when I wear out the knobbies, replace them with chunky road tread tires.

 

[Dirthog]

To help dampen the harshness of the aluminum frame and fork combo, I would go with the largest size tire that will fit comfortably along with a tread that fits your needs. I am pretty sure a 50mm width would work. Running tubeless you should be able to run 50mm tires at tire pressures in the low twenties if necessary to smooth out the ride. My gravel group rides a lot of rough gravel and single-track. Everyone in my gravel group of about 10 riders has a suspension stem, none have a dropper post on their gravel bike and only one rider uses a suspension seatpost.

 

[Smaug]

To help dampen the harshness of the aluminum frame and fork combo, I would go with the largest size tire that will fit comfortably along with a tread that fits your needs. I am pretty sure a 50mm width would work. Running tubeless you should be able to run 50mm tires at tire pressures in the low twenties if necessary to smooth out the ride. My gravel group rides a lot of rough gravel and single-track. Everyone in my gravel group of about 10 riders has a suspension stem, none have a dropper post on their gravel bike and only one rider uses a suspension seatpost.

I'll probably use this bike 80% on paved roads and 20% on gravel roads. I do like the chunky 40 mm tires that are on it now, so we'll have to see if I use it differently. Maybe I'll bring it to a gravel ride this year and ride it anyway, just don't enter for timed. Can I eke 80 miles out of a battery charge or will I be stuck doing the dreaded hike-a-bike up the tough hills later in the ride when it dies? (it weighs 47 lbs, IIRC)

What's funny is that I have two gravel bikes including this one. The other is a Priority Apollo 11, with belt drive and IGH. Neither of them are ideal for gravel rides/races, because the Yamaha doesn't qualify, being electric, and the Priority puts me at a handicap, due to the lower efficiency of the belt/IGH compared to chain/derailleur.

I toy with the idea of selling the Priority and getting a more conventional gravel bike, but I sure do like having zero chain maintenance and I'm not that serious of a gravel rider. It just sucks getting left behind by my one buddy that rides gravel and I'm SURE it's due to that last 5-10% of lost efficiency. I tell myself: "Well, this will make me stronger then." but it's still frustrating. ;-)

 

[Smaug]

I took the Wabash out for a rip at lunchtime today. 20-30 mph wind, gusting higher, so I was the only one out on a bike. Muggle bikers stay indoors. Temperature was 44 °F, but with such a spicy wind, it felt colder. I was a smidge under-dressed with a short sleeve golf shirt under my vented riding jacket. No overpants either.

Another 13 miles and no shut-down problem.

Ride stats:

 

[Annieolnie]

So, no issues with the Wabash so far?

 

[Smaug]

So, no issues with the Wabash so far?

No MORE issues, so far. ;-)

---

I think its time to add a rack, fenders, kickstand and a side exit bottle cage for the teeny little triangle.
I'll may go with a pannier-only rack, as there's not much room between the seat and rear wheel for a trunk bag.

 

[Annieolnie]

That's great! We need a fingers crossed emoji. I just picked up this little Rock Bros. bag. The $13.26 one. It's super handy for small stuff while I ride, even though I'm on a step through, it works.

 

[Smaug]

• Saddle: I decided that the saddle is too hard after all; needs a gap in the perineal region to keep the prostate area from going numb.
  I had a Brooks B67 (road shape, sprung) on a nail in the garage, so I swapped that on and will give it a try.
• Fenders: I ordered set of full Planet Bike fenders; they should be in this week.
• Kickstand: I bought a kickstand. The kickstand holes in the chain stay are smooth, but the bolts that came with the kickstand are only long enough for threaded kickstand holes. So I have to buy some hardware to mount it now. I'll have a look in my bolt box, but I don't think I have the right stuff. Gonna probably have to spend $10 on it at the hardware store.
• Rack: After I pick up the fenders and mount them, I'll mount the Topeak MTX rack, which already has my favorite Planet Bike Grateful Red tail light mounted on back.

 

[Annieolnie]

Do you have a Lowes in SE Wisconsin? I don't know why, but out here they do a much better job of carrying metric nuts and bolts and others at a reasonable price, plus they have small packets, so you can just get what you need.

 

[Smaug]

Do you have a Lowes in SE Wisconsin? I don't know why, but out here they do a much better job of carrying metric nuts and bolts and others at a reasonable price, plus they have small packets, so you can just get what you need.

We do, and thanks for the tip. I feel as though I've been raped every time I buy metric hardware at the local Ace...

 

[HumanPerson]

Do you have a Lowes in SE Wisconsin? I don't know why, but out here they do a much better job of carrying metric nuts and bolts and others at a reasonable price, plus they have small packets, so you can just get what you need.

oh they also have the thread and pitch tool for nuts and bolts

 

[HumanPerson]

I might eat bluegill eggs this yeah but wut time of year dom they spawn?

 

[LeVV]

I rode my road bike 70 miles Saturday. Halfway through the ride, a buddy I visited in the bike shop where he works invited me to join him and another guy for a gravel ride Sunday. I said: "Probably not; my legs will be shot from today's ride."

...but then I remembered that I'd just bought this electric gravel bike. Perfect! I thought I'd take that, and then just work as much or little as I wanted.
Alas, electrical demons reared their ugly heads. The display kept showing 'Err 71' and shutting down the electrics of the bike. I would restart the controller and it would work for a minute, or just a few seconds, then shut down again. I had to abandon the ride 16 miles in. (out of 33) Took the most direct route back to the parking lot and pedaled along unpowered. (11 miles)

I got home and looked into the Troubleshooting part of the manual, and this is the advice Yamaha gives me:

"There is a problem in the eBike Systems. Turn off the power and then turn it on again.
If the problem cannot be solved, have your bicycle inspected by a dealer as soon as possible.
For Er71 - The problem occurs in the battery pack. Remove the battery pack and check the battery capacity indicator lamps on the battery pack."

Those LEDs can tell us what different errors are. Mine just shows a full battery pack.

I did that, checked all the connections and made sure I had inserted the battery properly. No dice.

I wrote to the dealer asking what I should do. I was hoping he might file a warranty claim and get me a new battery. No response yet today. It's a 55 mile drive with Milwaukee in the middle, but I think I'm going to eventually have to make the journey and drop off the crippled bike.

I'm glad I have a couple other eBikes, or it would've been a lot more painful.

Fix I found for the Error 71 -

 

[Smaug]

Thanks!
I'll look and see if the dealer put those spacers in or what.
I haven't heard back yet about the free 2nd battery...

 

[farcaspian]

My first comment here. Read this whole thread, and I thank you for all the details. I have been eyeing a Wabash that's for sale near me on FBMP. This would be my first e-bike. I have 8 other analog bikes, mostly road but also a couple of gravel including a titanium one that I use for commute, 18 miles one way give or take. I have no issues pedaling loaded bike to work but its the whole process that is getting tiresome. i.e. load up panniers with shoes, extra clothes, laptop, charger, mouse what not, energy bars etc, fill up water bottles. Then once at work, take shower, change into work clothes, lock bags and bike up, hang damp clothes in the dryer and head for the meetings (finally).

With a bike like Wabash my hope is that I won't be sweaty/damp and can head to my desk straight away after locking the bike in the parking. How realistic is this? There are a couple of climbs with 8-10% grade on the way to work. I have only ridden an ebike once before at Zion NP and it was incredible! But it was a short round trip. I also think Wabash or bikes like that feel close to analog bikes v/s something Lectric with hub motor in the rear wheel - but I am open to that too. However with bikes like Lectric XP or Ride1up Portola (both foldable) I am seeing some terribly low range and I certainly don't want to get caught up halfway back home pedaling a 75lb bike with 4 inch wide tires. I am guessing Yamaha is much better in that regard. Thoughts?

 

[Dirthog]

It should be about the same as pedaling an analog bike at an easy pace on a slightly downhill road. You can make the steep climbs or any hill basically disappear using the motor at various assist levels. I have a Bosch powered e-gravel bike that has similar specs to the Wabash. And you are correct in that a bike like the Wabash is very efficient regarding battery usage as long as you ride at moderate speeds and only have occasional climbs.

 

[Smaug]

My first comment here. Read this whole thread, and I thank you for all the details.

That was my whole point of making a "review thread", hoping someone like me would see it before buying the bike.

I have been eyeing a Wabash that's for sale near me on FBMP. This would be my first e-bike. I have 8 other analog bikes, mostly road but also a couple of gravel including a titanium one that I use for commute, 18 miles one way give or take. I have no issues pedaling loaded bike to work but its the whole process that is getting tiresome. i.e. load up panniers with shoes, extra clothes, laptop, charger, mouse what not, energy bars etc, fill up water bottles. Then once at work, take shower, change into work clothes, lock bags and bike up, hang damp clothes in the dryer and head for the meetings (finally).

With a bike like Wabash my hope is that I won't be sweaty/damp and can head to my desk straight away after locking the bike in the parking. How realistic is this?

It's realistic. You could get an eBike with a hub motor that would be torquey enough, but the thing is that hub motors are geared for the maximum assisted speed of the eBike, so at lower speeds, they don't make any more torque. It's kind of a brute force approach.

With a mid-drive eBike, like the Wabash RT, the motor goes through the bike's gearing, so you have more torque available as you downshift to the lower gears. The downside is that you're putting all that extra power through the chain & sprockets, so they will wear faster. Just keep an eye on the chain and maybe bring a chain breaker and master link along with you.

With a 36 mile round trip commute, you could use Standard or Turbo assist settings, which are the highest two. (the lower two are Eco+ and Eco) and make the commute without charging or showering at work. You'd probably find yourself using Standard for the climbs, and turn it off for the descents.

Or mix it up: Turbo for the ride in, to stay dry, and just Eco on the way home.

There are a couple of climbs with 8-10% grade on the way to work. I have only ridden an ebike once before at Zion NP and it was incredible! But it was a short round trip. I also think Wabash or bikes like that feel close to analog bikes v/s something Lectric with hub motor in the rear wheel - but I am open to that too. However with bikes like Lectric XP or Ride1up Portola (both foldable) I am seeing some terribly low range and I certainly don't want to get caught up halfway back home pedaling a 75lb bike with 4 inch wide tires. I am guessing Yamaha is much better in that regard. Thoughts?

A Lectric XP4 has a plenty powerful hub motor, and while it wouldn't gear down to assist more for the climbs, YOU would be geared down and providing YOUR assistance for the climbs. Lectric is conservative with their motor ratings, compared to a lot of them. They're quite torquey and I think would do the job for you too.

A more practical city bike might be the Lectric One, with its belt drive and Pinion gearbox. More expensive, but still not Wabash expensive. It's frame doesn't fold, but the battery is easily removable without cracking the frame open, like on the XP line. Great reputation for being torquey. I have belt drive on one of my muggle bikes (Priority Apollo 11) and it's wondeful, not having to jerk around with the chain.

The real problem with hub drive eBikes is that they don't ever seem to have a properly low climbing gear, so you're using a lot of juice when you climb hills on them and if your battery runs dry, you're doing The Walk of Shame. I bought a Portola over an XP 3.0 a year or so ago, because of it's lower low gear, and it was still a chore to climb a Seattle-caliber hill in the lowest gear.

I bet that seller is selling his Wabash because he had the same problem I did, but didn't get it fixed. I never did check yet whether I still have the original battery or if the dealer replaced it with the "free second battery". It's possible the original battery was faulty, and that's what was causing the issue.

In short, I think you should settle on a mid-drive eBike. Doesn't necessarily have to be a Wabash. Check upway.co for what's available in your area. Any Gazelles? They're supposed to be awesome.

See if the seller will let you take it for a LONG ride, so you can confirm it's not cutting out before you buy it. Give him full disclosure on what you're doing. If he won't let you do that, with deposit in hand, then just walk away.

 

[farcaspian]

It's realistic. You could get an eBike with a hub motor that would be torquey enough, but the thing is that hub motors are geared for the maximum assisted speed of the eBike, so at lower speeds, they don't make any more torque. It's kind of a brute force approach.

With a mid-drive eBike, like the Wabash RT, the motor goes through the bike's gearing, so you have more torque available as you downshift to the lower gears. The downside is that you're putting all that extra power through the chain & sprockets, so they will wear faster. Just keep an eye on the chain and maybe bring a chain breaker and master link along with you.

Many thanks, Smaug! Exactly what I was looking for.

A Lectric XP4 has a plenty powerful hub motor, and while it wouldn't gear down to assist more for the climbs, YOU would be geared down and providing YOUR assistance for the climbs. Lectric is conservative with their motor ratings, compared to a lot of them. They're quite torquey and I think would do the job for you too.

During the July 4th sales, I pulled the trigger on XP 4, 750w model. The XP has one big advantage - it folds pretty small and I need as much space as I need with 8 other analog bikes sharing the room! It was delivered a couple of days ago and I put around 44 miles on it. My initial findings are somewhat of a mix-bag. On day 1, I rode out without charging as it had 70% from factory and because I was impatient. The battery dropped to below 10% (unfortunately it only goes +/- 10 in one go and not in between so I am guessing) in a touch above 15 mile round trip with me pedaling all the way.
On the second day, I made sure to charge to 100% and used the PAS modes carefully. I stuck between tour and sports modes and by the end of the 27 odd mile round trip I was left with 40% battery. The route had a few climbs and some long flats where I went all in maxing out at 28mph. I am somewhat doubtful that the battery won't last my work commute roundtrip of 40 miles.
I mean it could *technically* do 40+ miles but then I will have to use Eco or Tour mode - both of which are nearly useless. The bike only feels lively in Sport mode which I think is PAS 3 equivalent of older Lectric bikes. The Sport and above modes are fantastic but obviously need a lot of juice. I didn't even try Turbo as the Sport gives enough kick! Besides I like to pedal all the time too. With Turbo I am pretty sure it will overpower my legs.

The real problem with hub drive eBikes is that they don't ever seem to have a properly low climbing gear, so you're using a lot of juice when you climb hills on them and if your battery runs dry, you're doing The Walk of Shame. I bought a Portola over an XP 3.0 a year or so ago, because of it's lower low gear, and it was still a chore to climb a Seattle-caliber hill in the lowest gear.

Great point there. The largest cog is 32t. I am going to do some research tomorrow if anyone makes a 40t max, 8 speed freewheel. I wish they used a cassette. Finding a large cassette is easy but I don't think freewheels are abundant. FWIW, I managed a couple of 8-10% inclines fairly easily while pedaling on Sport mode. I think, if you don't fully rely on the throttle the 32t is just about passable for 8% grade. Anything above that and the battery is going to bleed profusely. I do have a 1 mile long 15% grade climb near my home. May be I will try that in the name of the science.

I bet that seller is selling his Wabash because he had the same problem I did, but didn't get it fixed. I never did check yet whether I still have the original battery or if the dealer replaced it with the "free second battery". It's possible the original battery was faulty, and that's what was causing the issue.

After I read your review I had the same thought. The ad said it only has 25 miles on the odo and they never received the second battery from Yamaha. Other than that there is no mention of any problems. It was bought in October of last year so about the same time as yours when Yamala pulled out of the market. The bike is still for sale with reduced price but now I am having second thoughts about the whole thing. I think I will wear out the XP 4 first.

As a sidenote, I had a chance to ride LeMond Prolog today at Seattle Electric Expo. It's a $6k bike with hub motor and carbon body, stunning looks and yet, I was not very impressed with the actual ride. The quality, fit and finish, controls, groupset is all top notch but I wished they went with a mid-drive motor rather than hub motor.