eBike for city trips and commuting

[StarShip]

Hello, I'm new to this forum. Ive had a look through the threads but couldnt find a thread like this but apologies id there is one I've missed.

Having recently moved to Switzerland and rented a few eBikes, I now want to take the plunge to buy my first ebike!

I'm searching for a petite, step through upright seated style / dutch style eBike with leather handles and comfy leather seat. I want it to look good, have good motor and other components from a reliable brand that my local bike shop will help me service. (In Switzerland, unfortunately the repair shops don't service small company names)

I'm a female, 151cm tall and not a confident cyclist so I would really like my toes to touch the ground when seated and for the bike to look and feel good to encourage me to cycle around the city/ lake and then with confidence do more.

I have tried the Riese and Muller Swing 4 (which comes in a frame size 43cm and with Bosch perf line motor, carbon belt, Kiox300 display and nice colours ).
I really liked the way it looks and I enjoyed the short (5min) test ride compared to many others mostly as the 43cm frame came with a 26inch wheel so it was easy for my feet to get to the ground... but I'm concerned because:
1. it only has rim brakes (I hear disc brakes are safer and more reliable)
2. the battery is on the back (I hear that the bike can shake if going slightly uphill and we have inclines here where we live)
3. it weighs around 26-28kg depending on the config. ( I can't lift it mire than 2cm off the ground)

Can anyone recommend any other bikes? I'm happy to pay more to get the right bike but I just cant find anything online when i'm searching. The bike shops here tend to sell what they get commission on or what they know which I think is predominantly mountain bikes or professional cycling bikes.
Thank you!!

 

[Annieolnie]

Have you looked a Gazelle ebikes? Some of them are of the style you like and have an integrated battery, also don't worry about the grips and seat, these can be changed out so easily you should just choose the bike you like and go looking for those later. You can also watch the Electroheads channel on YouTube. They follow a lot of the brands allowed in England and the EU. The presenter is a woman who takes into account how easy it is for her to move the bikes around. We Americans use bigger motors and like our bikes to pack a punch that Europe doesn't allow, so most of our experience isn't going to be too relevant. Let us know your thoughts and what you decide.

 

[StarShip]

@Annieolnie thank you! I found a shop that stocks the Gazelle ebikes and they have 4 bikes for small ish people. But they dont come with smalller tyres...
.
1. Gazelle EasyFlow- tiny 24inch wheels and my feet would touch the floor but i dont feel it the right bike as it looks strange.
2. Gazelle Paris - looks nice, with good step through and the smallest frame is 46inch but with 28inch wheels im not sure.
3. Gazelle Grenoble C5 - powerful ebike (I probably dont need that kind of torque) also comes in 46inch frame but wheels are 28inches
4. Gazelle Avignon c380 - powerful bike, wide tyres, on the heavier side, also comes in a 46inch frame but with 28inch wheels.

I have seen a bike that works for small people online but its only in the UK

Volt Kensington | Step Through Electric Bicycle

Volt Kensington Step Through Electric Bicycle. Details and photos of the latest and higher spec'd Step Through Electric Bicycle from Volt

voltbikes.co.uk

So I cant order it or get it serviced here .

Any tips welcome!

 

[Annieolnie]

Oddly, most of the cafe style bikes you like are going to have slightly larger wheels, because that's the style. Lekker makes a gorgeous bike, but once again, larger wheels. They ship to France but not specifically Switzerland. I have no idea what that is about. Their bike has a seat that can go very low and a quill stem, which could be lowered. One thing to think about is all bikes can have shorter pedal cranks put on them, most come with 170mm cranks which, really is for someone 5 ft 10 and up. You would probably like 160mm cranks. If you think about it, with the crank down, that gives your leg less further to go. Unless you start looking at the 20 inch wheel style bikes ( a lot of the folders) you are going to be a bit stuck. I'm going to post the Lekker bike pic here just because it is pretty and has a belt drive.

 

[Chiligirl]

Have you considered any of these bikes? These seem to be suited for more petite riders

Gazelle​

• Gazelle CityZen: This model offers a comfortable riding position, a powerful Bosch motor, and a stylish design. It's a popular choice among urban commuters.

Riese & Müller​

• Riese & Müller Superdelite: Known for its luxurious features and high-quality components, the Superdelite is a premium option. It offers a comfortable ride, a powerful motor, and a stylish design.

Winora​

• Winora Sinus: This model is a good balance of performance and affordability. It has a comfortable riding position, a reliable Bosch motor, and a stylish design.

Urban Arrow​

• Urban Arrow Family: While primarily known for cargo bikes, Urban Arrow also offers regular eBikes. The Family model is a good option for those who want a comfortable ride and a versatile bike that can handle various tasks.

These are all European brands. I assume that they are available in local bike shops in Switzerland

 

[Smaug]

Hi StarShip. Riese & Muller are known for making nice eBikes, same for Gazelle. Those are high-dollar bikes for us here in the USA, so not a lot of us know about them. Most local shops don't carry them here either.

What brands do your local shops carry? That is a good place to start.

If I were you, I would plan on learning to ride without having the seat so low that your feet touch the ground. By having the seat that low, you are giving up a huge amount of torque that your legs can generate when they are at near full extension near the bottom of the pedal stroke. The trick to this is that you need to learn to balance your weight on the lower pedal as you roll to a stop. (either foot) This is Bicycling 101 and I think you will be surprised how quickly you learn it.

You do not need necessarily need small wheels. Larger wheels roll more efficiently, and will result in longer battery life, with all else being equal. The most common size is 70 cm.

Disc brakes are practically superior to rim brakes, especially in the rain, snow or mud, where they will stay clean and work a lot better. They also will not overheat easily going down large hills or mountains. I would stick to your instinct to get a bike with disc brakes. Some road cyclists stuck to rim brakes for awhile because they are lighter and can be more aerodynamic, but disc brakes have been shown to be superior on any kind of big descent.

As for the battery location, I think your main concern should be whether you will need to bring it inside (separate from the bike) to charge it. If you have a place to charge the bike where it is parked and that place never gets too cold (below freezing), then the battery can be anywhere and it doesn't even need to be detachable. If your storage place for the bike gets cold or hot, then a removable battery is a big benefit. I wouldn't worry about it being in the rear rack unless it is not firmly mounted. I would worry more that rear rack-mounted battery raises the rack bottom, so you'll have less room for a trunk bag. You'll likely need to use panniers instead to carry your things, in that case.

The weight is always going to be a compromise. Most eBikes weigh at least double what a regular bike will weigh, on account of needing a motor, drivetrain, heavier-duty brakes & tires, etc. Lighter eBikes will either have less range, less power, be more expensive or some combination of these things. I see that in Switzerland, you have two classes of eBike before they are considered motorcycles:

"

• slow e-bikes (pedal assistance up to 25 km/h)
• fast e-bikes ("Speed Pedelec") (pedal assistance up to 45 km/h)

Fast e-bikes are considered to be motorised bicycles (mopeds). Two-wheelers with a motor power of more than 1,000 watts or a maximum speed of more than 45 km/h belong to the ‹motorcycle› category." The fast eBike would be useful in that you can ride in the road and keep up on slower streets where cars and motorcycles ride in the city, but annual cost of operation will be higher, as they require licensing, etc.

Source and more information: https://www.ch.ch/en/vehicles-and-t...tzerland/#rules-for-e-bikes-electric-bicycles

 

[StarShip]

Have you considered any of these bikes? These seem to be suited for more petite riders

Gazelle​

• Gazelle CityZen: This model offers a comfortable riding position, a powerful Bosch motor, and a stylish design. It's a popular choice among urban commuters.

Riese & Müller​

• Riese & Müller Superdelite: Known for its luxurious features and high-quality components, the Superdelite is a premium option. It offers a comfortable ride, a powerful motor, and a stylish design.

Winora​

• Winora Sinus: This model is a good balance of performance and affordability. It has a comfortable riding position, a reliable Bosch motor, and a stylish design.

Urban Arrow​

• Urban Arrow Family: While primarily known for cargo bikes, Urban Arrow also offers regular eBikes. The Family model is a good option for those who want a comfortable ride and a versatile bike that can handle various tasks.

These are all European brands. I assume that they are available in local bike shops in Switzerland

thank you, whilst these brands are available, none are in the dutch style bikes shape.

 

[StarShip]

Hi StarShip. Riese & Muller are known for making nice eBikes, same for Gazelle. Those are high-dollar bikes for us here in the USA, so not a lot of us know about them. Most local shops don't carry them here either.

What brands do your local shops carry? That is a good place to start.

If I were you, I would plan on learning to ride without having the seat so low that your feet touch the ground. By having the seat that low, you are giving up a huge amount of torque that your legs can generate when they are at near full extension near the bottom of the pedal stroke. The trick to this is that you need to learn to balance your weight on the lower pedal as you roll to a stop. (either foot) This is Bicycling 101 and I think you will be surprised how quickly you learn it.

You do not need necessarily need small wheels. Larger wheels roll more efficiently, and will result in longer battery life, with all else being equal. The most common size is 70 cm.

Disc brakes are practically superior to rim brakes, especially in the rain, snow or mud, where they will stay clean and work a lot better. They also will not overheat easily going down large hills or mountains. I would stick to your instinct to get a bike with disc brakes. Some road cyclists stuck to rim brakes for awhile because they are lighter and can be more aerodynamic, but disc brakes have been shown to be superior on any kind of big descent.

As for the battery location, I think your main concern should be whether you will need to bring it inside (separate from the bike) to charge it. If you have a place to charge the bike where it is parked and that place never gets too cold (below freezing), then the battery can be anywhere and it doesn't even need to be detachable. If your storage place for the bike gets cold or hot, then a removable battery is a big benefit. I wouldn't worry about it being in the rear rack unless it is not firmly mounted. I would worry more that rear rack-mounted battery raises the rack bottom, so you'll have less room for a trunk bag. You'll likely need to use panniers instead to carry your things, in that case.

The weight is always going to be a compromise. Most eBikes weigh at least double what a regular bike will weigh, on account of needing a motor, drivetrain, heavier-duty brakes & tires, etc. Lighter eBikes will either have less range, less power, be more expensive or some combination of these things. I see that in Switzerland, you have two classes of eBike before they are considered motorcycles:

"

• slow e-bikes (pedal assistance up to 25 km/h)
• fast e-bikes ("Speed Pedelec") (pedal assistance up to 45 km/h)

Fast e-bikes are considered to be motorised bicycles (mopeds). Two-wheelers with a motor power of more than 1,000 watts or a maximum speed of more than 45 km/h belong to the ‹motorcycle› category." The fast eBike would be useful in that you can ride in the road and keep up on slower streets where cars and motorcycles ride in the city, but annual cost of operation will be higher, as they require licensing, etc.

Source and more information: https://www.ch.ch/en/vehicles-and-t...tzerland/#rules-for-e-bikes-electric-bicycles

hello @Smaug - Thank you!
The most common bike brands here are : Reise and Muller, Gazelle, Cube, Tour De Swiss, Crest, Specialized, Cortina, Koga.
I hear what you are saying about the bigger wheel. The common wheel size went from 26inch to 28inch here, its just the bigger the wheel the less I can easily turn etc so in a cityits tricky.
Also you really got me thinking about the last bike shop that I went to, as they tried to teach me how to stop slowly with my lower leg on the bottom of the pedal so I could jump off. I realised I could ride a bike where my feet don't touch the floor after all. I felt unstable and comfortable as i'm not an experienced cyclist so still worry that I may need to stop suddenly and I wouldn't be able to get off the bike.

I wondered if i should rent a bike for a while to see if I get used to it, but then the one i rented was from a company called diamont and I didnt like riding it. So its only worth renting one I like otherwise it will put me off cycling.

Wish me luck as I try a. new bike shop next week

thank you

 

[Smaug]

hello @Smaug - Thank you!
The most common bike brands here are : Reise and Muller, Gazelle, Cube, Tour De Swiss, Crest, Specialized, Cortina, Koga.
I hear what you are saying about the bigger wheel. The common wheel size went from 26inch to 28inch here, its just the bigger the wheel the less I can easily turn etc so in a cityits tricky.

The larger wheel making turns difficult is only noticeable for very low speed turns, just above walking speed. Or indoors or in vehicles/trains.

For smaller people, bigger wheels don't always make sense, because smaller people need a smaller frame and big wheels don't scale well with smaller frames. Try not to go under 70 cm or 26 inch wheel diameter unless storage space is an issue.

Also you really got me thinking about the last bike shop that I went to, as they tried to teach me how to stop slowly with my lower leg on the bottom of the pedal so I could jump off. I realised I could ride a bike where my feet don't touch the floor after all. I felt unstable and comfortable as i'm not an experienced cyclist so still worry that I may need to stop suddenly and I wouldn't be able to get off the bike.

You will get the hang of it, don't worry. It's an important skill.

I wondered if i should rent a bike for a while to see if I get used to it, but then the one i rented was from a company called diamont and I didnt like riding it. So its only worth renting one I like otherwise it will put me off cycling.

Wish me luck as I try a. new bike shop next week

thank you

Good luck and you're welcome!

I like the look of the Specialized city bikes. Their front fenders extend quite far down to keep your feet clean when you hit a puddle or patch of dirt. Very nice lines, too.

Some other things to consider:

• You might ask about the warranty and also which manufacturers are most supportive in case of trouble after the sale. They will know, because they have to order the parts and deal with them on behalf of the customer.
• Look for bikes that are made to carry luggage. All city commuters should be able to accommodate a rear rack that will accept panniers and preferably also a front rack mounted to the frame. (not handlebar)
• Look for full coverage fenders, or "mudguards", as the British call them. They will keep you and your bike clean and dry
• Integrated lights that run from the eBike's battery are great to have.
• Belt drive is nice to have. They are practically zero maintenance, very clean and last 3X longer than a chain. If you don't get belt drive, look for a bike with a chain guard that will keep your pant leg clean. It's very hard not to get greased by a chain when you're moving the bike around: into and out of a car or train, into your home, etc.