That is pretty interesting. Crazy. But interesting.The first person you spoke to was almost certainly the owner of the company.
If you would like to get paid, tell him you have my personal identifying information. At one time, he offered to pay $1,000 in cash for it. Site admin was offered $25,000 for "favors", one of which was refusing to provide documentation of this criminal act. I still have screenshots of a mod admitting to these actions.
They do not "manufacture" any of their products, most of their "innovations" are stolen from other, better companies, the owner is believed by most who have met him to suffer from serious psychological issues, they refuse to honor warranties until users have deleted their detailed complaint posts, and he or one of his minions will likely appear to state "Nelson37 is telling lies about me."
Most of the people who post favorably about the company or their products have been paid or received free product in order to do so. Users D8veh and AlanB specifically, both of whom I believe are ashamed of their actions. They specifically pimped a known defective product which is no longer sold by the company, because some angry dude would not allow it to be lied about and refused to be intimidated by his bullying, threats. lies, or bribes. Three guesses who that was. Several dozen owners of a pile of broken, useless junk wish I had done it sooner.
When I posted legally accurate information about Federal regulations regarding warranty protections and available avenues for consumer protection under "lemon laws", that information was deleted from the website. Not once, not twice, but three seperate times. That is what a "gift" of $25,000 to a site admin will buy you.
As for alternatives - there is a nice kid in Canada with a smile who is reputable, but a bit pricey. Also an Englishman in China who used to be a Mac dealer and now sells only batteries. Again reputable with good products but also a bit pricey. Justin and Paul.
I did buy one of their 48 V chargers had a problem with it let them know and they replaced it didn't even ask for the old one back. So it sounds like it depends on who you talk to there and what you're asking them. I hate companies that operate that way.Geez, I thought they were the only place around that was reliable. I guess I need to look elsewhere any ideas?
Nelson can you share what kit you went with and had the good luck with? I'm thinking of converting my HImiway rear hub to Mid Drive but it seems there are only two options for a kit of sorts. I have been leaning towards the Bafang because of aftermarket support for their product line. You can DM if you prefer.These events all happened many years ago. The loon has always been an as***le. I did quite a bit of digging into his history, going back 10-15 years. I know a LOT about this ahole.
I have exchanged messages with one current and two ex-employees. They all describe a hostile work environment, unhinged and unethical behavior by the owner, and relief from the two who no longer work there. One of these described numerous late-nite, hang-up phone calls after he quit, cars parked on his street which drove away when he approached, he went to the point of getting a carry permit. He believed not likely an actual threat, just childish harassment, but choose to be safe rather than sorry.
The reason he could not buy the site for $20,000 was because NOBODY wanted him in charge of it. Bunch of stuff happened before I got there, had to read a lot of very old posts to dig some of this up. Site is very old, for this industry.
I have dealt with many trolls over the decades, not too long ago there was a particularly malicious troll on a sports team website I decided needed to be removed. He ended up in a mental institution, I put him there. He was evil, but at least intelligent and well-educated. Part of what pissed me off about his malicious behavior.
The loon and his trolls were mostly childish and stupid. I was accused of using "inflammatory language" for suggesting people read the thread and count the broken motors. At one point, he responded to me with a video of a chimpanzee shooting an automatic rifle at other humans. There were two "new users", who made an account, sent me a grade-school, childish PM, then deleted their account immediately after. Both of these were the loon himself. He is known to the mods to post under multiple user names, will say a bunch of crazy crap, pimping his stuff and telling lies about other vendors, and then, mysteriously, the account and ALL POSTS would be deleted. The $25,000 man at work. No records of the craziness. Except for somebody with a very good memory who reads voraciously.
He repeatedly threatened legal action, I stated I would love to get him into open court and put documentation on the record, threats, criminal acts, violations of warranty regulations, etc. That crap ended pretty quickly.
The motor kit in question had a unique capability, and had been highly anticipated by many. Then the first breakage reports came flowing in, and it was "oh well, great idea, poor design" and it was mostly forgotten. Then, the long thread on it came to life, with many new users singing it's praises. This was when the loon bought a bunch with his logo, and started pushing them. That is when the craziness began. " The loon is a visionary who is saving the planet", I said ", well, it breaks a lot". "Nelson37 is telling lies about me, he is making stuff up", "Read the thread and count the broken motors!" "Nelson37 is using inflammatory language!". He was pimping them on multiple sites. The thread was over 50 pages.
He would say "they have fixed the problem, I know because I drank beer with the factory sales reps, and they told me so." As someone who has frequently drank beer with factory sales reps, these men are professional liars. The problem stayed the same, it was never fixed. The design was changed three seperate times, at least two of these meant to solve the problem, each time the loon crowed it was fixed now, and each time the breakage reports just kept coming. Out of 25-30 seperate motors, 14 failed totally due to the design flaw, and two more had failed Hall sensors.
There were 3-4 more which had not broken yet, but were showing signs of being about to.
You get an idea the size of the site when a fairly obscure motor has over 20 different users reporting on it. One guy fixed his once, and it broke a second time, a few more bought multiple units.
The website is a fantastic repository of information, 98% of what I know about ebikes I learned there. However, they have continually refused to admit that the doxxing ever took place, my last attempt to get them to come clean was about two years ago. No more. I thought seriously about taking legal action against the owner, but he truly is a nice kid who really is a visionary pioneer trying to save the planet. I do not think he is fully aware.
In addition to the site admin who got the $25,000, another moderator there is on the loon's payroll, and has been involved in his business since day one. A knowledgeable and somewhat ethical guy, but he is a moderator on a vendors payroll and was very much against identifying himself as such in his sig line. There where a few discussions about this. He is definitely a shill for the loon.
The motor kit in question would have been perfect for my needs, if it had worked. I ended up researching and purchasing something different, without the unique capability, which was the source of all the problems. 8 years and 25,000 miles later, my kit still works great, I have not seen anyone post about having one of the other kits that still works for a couple years now.
as aboveNelson can you share what kit you went with and had the good luck with? I'm thinking of converting my HImiway rear hub to Mid Drive but it seems there are only two options for a kit of sorts. I have been leaning towards the Bafang because of aftermarket support for their product line. You can DM if you prefer.